Any general will tell you that knowing the terrain and position of troops is paramount to success. It’s the same in Daygame and dating: the most technical section is the street set and it becomes less technical from there. I thought about what the next most complicated part of the process is and settled on the first venue.
Some people might say that escalation is a harder part of the process, but in my opinion it’s easier: to me escalation is about reading simple signals (red, amber, green) and proceeding accordingly with a ladder. Once you have an escalation ladder in place then you just need to learn how to artfully apply it.
The first venue has always stood out to me as more important because of how you’re setting the frame for the rest of the date. It’s the point where where you’re making decisions about how the rest of the date is going to be escalated. It’s where you do a lot of digging and solidify a big chunk of the dossier you have on the girl, and confirm any suspicions you’d had so far. It’s the place where you realise how well you’re going to fare with the girl, and is the first time she gets a proper look at the real you.
I thought to myself I can write a little guide on running the first venue, it’ll be fun. A few recent first dates let me crystallise the ideas that I had and so I decided to put them together into a post. Over the next four days I’ll be releasing it.
This is a post about dates from my perspective – and with my Game – and so I’ve focused on the things I believe to be most important. I’ve made certain assumptions which you might not abide by. I’m coming from a certain perspective which you might not be coming from. Because of that, take what I’ve written with a grain of salt with regards to applying it because it’s not universal.
What’s better is to see what stands out to you as you read it and see what you want to incorporate on your own Game. I’ve always found that aping certain PUAs gave me some degree of success, but less than when the initial effect had worn off. In the long run I’ve become a conglomeration of my own personality and bits taken from a few trusted sources.
Also remember that this is based on dates which have occurred in London, so take that into account when you compare it to your own experience and find differences.
- Good faith: I approach the date assuming that the girl is an honest person. She’s not there to waste my time, has at least a little sexual interest in me and – given enough comfort and that I don’t fuck it up – will have sex with me. Of course it’s my decision how many dates I’m willing to go on to reach sex and so if she can’t be brought down to my price then I’ll probably just blow the date and over escalate. Better to risk it than face sunk costs later on.
- Tit-for-tat strategy is in effect: there’s a long Womaniser’s Bible podcast on this topic called “Play Or Be Played” which you can listen to for more information. Essentially it means I will be a real person as long as she is. I’m not going to be gamey without her playing silly buggers. Essentially we are part not part of a zero-sum game; the game is win-win.
- The goal is sex by the most efficient route and you are playing an r-selected sexual strategy
There’s actually a lot to think about before we dive into the first venue proper. Firstly we need a quick note on closing. Did you:
- Suggest a coffee date?
- Suggest a drink?
Religiously asking the girl out for a drink to show intent is a beginner’s fallacy: beginner’s advice is designed to accelerate progress with Yes girls because Yes girls enjoy it when you show more obvious romantic/sexual interest. It’s quite clear that once you move to the intermediate stage and beyond that there’s more nuance to it. We know that interest is better shown by touch, proximity and eye contact, and that when you’re really on form that suggesting a simple coffee is tantamount to soliciting sex.
As mentioned previously suggesting a drink is good for Yes and strong Maybe girls. If you spot sufficient interest: higher energy verbals, playing along with any roleplay, actual verbal IOIs, etc.; and more importantly: her allowing you to close proximity during the set; her accepting your kino, then suggest a drink.
The key difference between suggesting a drink and a coffee is the investment required from her. If you suggest a drink her mind can go a lot further in coming up with bad possibilities than if you suggest coffee, which she knows she can quite easily walk out of after 30 minutes if it’s awkward. So for the low to mid Maybe girls just suggest a coffee. Remember this is in-set, there’ll be a chance to escalate things later on if you spot good signals; suggesting a coffee in-set doesn’t mean you absolutely will meet for a coffee and nothing more. It certainly doesn’t mean you will be friend zoned.
Another consideration you should take into account is where she lies on the r/K spectrum. Don’t get too hung up on exactly where she sits, just give her a rough evaluation using your gut instinct of “more r” or “more K.” There is a table later on this post which will help you decide. As a rule of thumb, if you judge her to be more r-selected, then suggest a drink with the mid Maybe girls as well.
Now we turn to the date request. This is the same as you would do usually except I like to throw in a little technique using emoticons. For a girl who you asked out for coffee but who is now showing strong interest over messaging, put the coffee and two-beers-clinking emoticon after your date request. E.g.:
“How about we meet Wednesday or Thursday? [emoticon] [emoticon]”
It leaves the nature of the date up in the air and gives you more wiggle room for later on. As I go through this post I’ve put quotes around coffee to indicate that the date is up in the air.
On the day make sure to send a simple text checking that she is still up for meeting, and make sure to include a question. Don’t overthink this one and don’t be gamey. I will send a simple “Still good for tonight? [thumbs up]” to check. It is vital that you include a question mark so that she’s encouraged to respond and it saves you wondering whether she will actually come when she doesn’t respond to your statement. If she doesn’t respond to your message you should just stay at home and not risk being stood up.
Now that you know whether the first venue will be coffee, “coffee” or drinks we need to select venues.
The first thing to consider is location: near yours i.e. within walking distance of your flat, or in the centre of London (I live near but not in the centre of London so this shapes my advice).
- If we’re definitely going to meet for a drink then I suggest meeting near to mine.
- If we’re going to meet for a coffee or a “coffee” then I suggest central London
It’s all to do with escalation and how fast I think I can get her to the finishing line. It’s better to make your move with the girls who like you a lot early because then they can either accept or at least tell you “not tonight.” For the girls with low to mid interest you can lay all the groundwork on the first date so that on the second date it’s already a done deal.
Here are desirable aspects of each type of first venue:
Coffee/”Coffee”: a place which serves both coffee/tea and alcohol. If she wants to drink then she can and this is explored more later on.
Drink: any decent, normal pub but avoid one showing sports because it will be too crowded and loud. If it’s logistically advantageous then use the coffee venue you like because it serves alcohol too anyway.
Desirable aspects for both types of venue in order of importance:
- Seats facing each other
- Chairs must have backs i.e. not stools with just the cushion. This is important for the body language you want to use later on.
- At most a five minute walk from your meeting place: walking too long stifles any tension and she’ll make awkward “where are we going” comments.
- Somewhere that’s not too busy, but not too quiet; it’s useful to have the plausible deniability of being able to say “sit a little closer I can’t hear you.”
- Medium lighting
Part two out tomorrow.