This is the first re-draft of a chapter from my upcoming book, as voted for by you. You can find the details here and the original posts here and here. I hope you enjoy this post and I’d be interested to hear your thoughts in the comment section.
I’m going to be harsh in this chapter and give you some realistic expectations for what someone can achieve in Daygame in terms of quantity and quality. It makes for some daunting reading.
This whole chapter is dependent on your starting SMV. If you start with a higher SMV then you can get higher quality to begin with, and over time. Remember that the sexual marketplace (SMP) aims to match up high value men with high value women. We all have something to offer (our value) and we try to find others who we can trade it with. Men typically have value in areas such as resource generation and protection, whereas women typically have value in their beauty and nurturing ability. As a mammalian species we have two genders which complement each other and the SMP works to create partnerships of complementary ability. SMV is the currency of the SMP, and so anytime sex occurs there must have been something that each party valued in the other, even if there, on the surface, appears to be a mismatch: maybe the guy is “just her type” or vice versa. In that case there is something specific about that person that the other person values.
Remember that you can’t cheat the SMV. If you’re a male six – all told i.e. including your looks, status and behaviours – then you cannot bang a female seven. We will get back to this later, but it’s an important message to hold in your head as you go along: the SMP matches up high SMV men all told with high SMV women all told. The only way to get a girl above your long term SMV is to take advantage of the daily swings in your vibe.
Just as an obvious disclaimer: people don’t walk around with a social score-esque rating above their head which indicates their SMV. However, humans are great at measuring things relative to other things – for example, humans can tell if a room is hotter or colder than another but not their exact temperatures – and so people are good at assessing whether someone is roughly below, in the same, or above their league, SMV wise.
Potential SMV is also a big thing. Work on your looks and your behaviours and nurture your vibe in the medium to long term and maybe an average guy can improve himself from a five to a six all told. Sounds like a small difference – one which will take a monumental amount of effort once he gets beyond the initial burst of cleaning up his life – but it makes laying sixes much easier, saving many hours of work, and you might just luck your way to a few sevens as well on those days of terrific vibe. It also puts the eights within reach given the guy has the perfect combination of luck, persistence, tenacity, determination, etc, on the day in question. Your potential SMV is going to govern your ceiling in Daygame.
Potential SMV is also capped, by the way; no amount of telling yourself “I’m a ten” will actually make you a ten. Now, we all go through a “fake it til you make it” phase in the beginning where we’re trying to big ourselves up to have a higher SMV than we really have but that illusion wears off. Once it does you’re going to need to rely on real value. Essentially: don’t disregard the “making it.” As I alluded to before you have to actually give her a reason to have sex with you. SMV is king.
So what are some realistic expectations:
If you start out as an absolutely average guy but show dedication, consistency, persistence, smarts, curiousity and can handle rejection and possess a huge list of the qualities that makes someone good at Daygame, and get near your potential SMV, plus there’s nothing else going on in your life which will affect your ability to approach (e.g. too much work, death in the family, etc.) then you can expect to get around 12 lays a year. 11 one year, 13 the next, etc; it averages out.
I’m basing that number on all the conversations I’ve had with Daygamers over the past years plus my experience coaching. It is extremely rare for me to meet someone who’s actually getting 12 (or, even rarer, more) lays a year.
What stands out to me is how low that number may seem. You have to have all your ducks in a row, work very hard and yet you’re only going to get 12 lays in a year? Famously, “an intermediate Daygamer should expect to get 12 lays a year” but from talking to so many Daygamers and finding out what their lay counts really are, 12 is more like a figure which will put you in a very high percentile.
The issue at play here is survivorship bias (in fact, on further thought this is the main driver behind the first part of this chapter). For some to be Daygaming beyond their first summer puts them, already, into a statistically improbable camp. When I first wrote this post a common objection I got was “yeah but I know person XYZ and they got 12 lays a year easy.” Firstly, that’s an anecdote, and secondly, you’re forgetting the hundreds of guys that failed at the very first hurdle: approach anxiety. Daygamers, as they progress, tend to congregate with other experienced Daygamers and so forget the hundreds of beginners who dropped out.
Not only is it very rare for a Daygamer to get to 12 lays, the lays are distributed exponentially. That means that most of the guys getting laid from Daygame are still only getting a few lays each year. Here’s the (stylised) distribution:
- 0-3 lays per year: 90% of Daygamers
- 4-6 lays per year: 5% of Daygamers
- 7-9 lays per year: 3% of Daygamers
- 10-12 lays per year: 1% of Daygamers
- 12+ lays per year: 0.1% of Daygamers
(who knows where the remaining 0.9% went. I don’t. Do you?)
It’s also a point to note that that distribution includes those skilled Daygamers who live in smaller cities, who’s upper ceiling of lays per year is constricted by population. Another point to consider are the guys who are seeing girls more than once and trying to keep girls on rotation; naturally their drive to chase new lays will be curtailed. Overall, I repeat, it is extremely rare to find a Daygamer with 12 or more lays in a year.
Male SMV is made up of your looks, status and behaviours. Some examples are:
- Looks: height, bodyfat %, facial structure, muscularity (to a point), style
- Status: visible wealth, social circle, ecosystem
- Behaviours: Game, likeability, leadership, vibe
Broadly speaking your looks provide the most r-selected value and your status provides the most k-selected value. There is some crossover to note such as a tan indicating that you have the means and time to holiday in warm locations (looks providing k-selected value: status) and your age (if a man is older he is implied to have higher status, but this will also amplify your dominance and give more r-selected value). Featuring in both r and k-selected value are your behvaiours.
You’ve also got your long term and short term SMV. The big difference being that your vibe fluctuates from day to day and can increase the latter. So you might be a six in all areas of your life, but on a particularly great day of vibe, that six might get boosted to a seven purely from your positive mindset. Alternatively you might get out of the wrong side of the bed that morning and hit the streets as a five. Practising good vibe management will allow you to tilt those short term fluctuations positively. If you could – somehow – plot your total SMV over time then that would be your long term SMV. Strategic Game – where you change your looks, status, behaviours, location, etc. over time – allows you to increase your long term SMV.
I like what Krauser said in Adventure Sex in that girls don’t really think in ratings like guys do. They think in terms of categories:
- Hot (hawt!)
This is how I’d interpret those categories if we mapped them to a number. Note that I’m talking about r-selected sex and so these numbered ratings represent your r-selected value (looks plus crossover status plus behaviours):
- Invisible: five and below; it doesn’t make sense for a girl who is at least a five to go anywhere near a guy who’s also a five when she can get fast sex from a six or better
- Dateable: six to seven
- Hot: eight
So at a higher level what this means is Daygame is all about male sixes, sevens and eights going after female sixes, sevens and eights (and in all honesty, the male sixes are banging some female fives as well). And let’s be straight here: just as it’s extremely rare to find a guy getting 12 or more lays a year from Daygame, it’s just as rare amongst those guys to find someone who has laid an honest to God, creme de la creme nine. For nearly everyone reading this, stop talking about the nines because they genuinely are out of your league. Eight is the upper limit. And this isn’t a limiting belief; the SMP matches high value men with high value women. What’s more limiting is your SMV.
Okay, so what kind of quality can a guy expect? Firstly there’s the issue that looks are distributed normally. That means that for every six there isn’t an equal number of sevens, and for every seven there isn’t an equal number of eights. In fact the proportion decreases as we go: there are less sevens than sixes, but there are even less eights than sevens. That is, for every deviation you move away from the mean (a five) the proportion of the next deviation is lower than the previous one. At the end of the day, the vast majority of people look or look close to average. In practice that means that your average quality is likely to be below your own rating because of sheer population effects and hypergamy. Remember that girls don’t sleep with guys who they think are below their league, but guys will sleep with a girl who is below theirs if the lay is easy enough. That means that for sex to occur the girl must perceive the guy’s SMV to at least be equal to hers; the alternative condition need not be true.
A lot of guys will regurgitate the phrase that “Game is two points hotter” but from what I’ve seen this is such an anomaly that it isn’t true in practice. Guys who are average in every area of their life do not just start practising Game and start laying true sevens. It’s not like just putting on a new set of clothes.
Firstly, Game isn’t an on/off switch: in the time it takes for them to learn and become proficient they will/should have improved other areas of their lives, making them better than average. Secondly, most guys don’t actually have the talent to become very good at Game because of all the rejection they will need to face. If a guy consistently practises Game he will almost certainly be able to get better at it – it will contribute to his life – but he’s unlikely to be very good. Lastly, if you do see a guy who is “average in every area of their life” become successful with Game then he is, by backwards induction, showing that he “had it in him all along;” people don’t tend to grow these personality traits if they never had them. That is, he had the prerequisite qualities to succeed such as determination, persistence and resistance, all along. This suggests that Game is the conduit through which a man’s conscientious traits are awakened.
Maybe it would be the case that “Game is two points hotter” if looks were the only thing that mattered, but they don’t: your status and behaviours matter too; a guy with average looks might have a lot of status and have a likeable personality; that would mean that his all told SMV was more than just five out of ten. Bragging about your skill by purely comparing looks to looks is misleading and is based in a feminine worldview: that your own value is mainly looks based. Luckily for us men, we have many strong possible sources of SMV.
In reality: “vibe is one or two points hotter” (and two points is the stretchiest of the absolute stretches that you can imagine; we’re talking some of the best days of your life here). You have your r-selected value and then your vibe is the thing that fluctuates from day to day. That is the x-factor which can get you girls hotter than your long term station.
It should also be said that the proportion of guys, as you move from stage to stage, is even less than for girls because of hypergamy. The incentive for a guy to be one point hotter is more than for a girl, because if a guy is only one iota better than his peers then he’ll take the lion’s share of the spoils. One man can impregnate and protect multiple women and so the rewards to competition are massive. So, in a contrived example, there might be three female sevens to ten female sixes, but only two male sevens to ten male sixes, and so on. This competition leads to longer tails in the distribution of male ability: higher genetic variability means there’s a better chance that one of your sons becomes the tribal chief and takes all the rewards. The flipside is that there are a lot more weird guys then there are weird girls.
REALISTIC EXPECTATIONS GIVEN MALE QUALITY
Now let’s take a hypothetical guy who is a five (completely average looking, average height, average muscle, average job, average life experience, average Game, etc.) and through a few years of hard work on his looks and Game managed to improve himself to a six. Maybe he also travels more often to the places where his particular look/genetic makeup gets him the furthest (though remember the adage “if you can’t get laid at home then you won’t get laid away”). This is the kind of quality that a guy can expect to get.
- 0 – 1 eights
- 1 – 2 sevens
- 3 – 6 sixes
- 2 – 4 fives
Remember, these figures are for a guy who has worked extremely hard to turn himself from a five (all told) into a six (all told), does not encounter any difficulties in his life which would curtail his Daygaming, and is in that 1% of Daygamers who manages to get about 12 lays in a year, on average. Obviously if he was getting less than 12 then you would need to scale down the numbers accordingly as well as if his SMV was lower/higher than six.
Of course I acknowledge that there’s a subjective element to rating girls, but I’ve Daygamed for long enough now and talked to enough Daygamers to get a good understanding of what counts as a global five, six, seven or eight. I’ve also seen enough guys try Daygame and seen the reactions they get to be able to rank them too. That influences my ratings and distributions above. On the other hand, when a guy is a beginner or lower intermediate they tend to rate their girls more on what their pre-Game expectations were which leads to over-rating. For them an eight is simply any girl more attractive than their last girlfriend before Game. I was guilty of this myself and so ended up lowering a few ratings on my blog’s statistics page once I had more perspective and less ego involved.
Given the distribution of hotness amongst girls and the effect of population, we can now form some expectations for what guys can expect.
Male Six: this guy’s average quality (add up the ratings and divide by the number of lays) is going to be slightly lower than six. Most of his lays will be with fellow sixes but for every seven that he lays there might be two fives (if he’s being totally honest with himself). Male sixes have the most pressure in the community to lie about their quality because of the stigma of claiming a five.
Male Seven: the average quality will be slightly lower than seven. He’ll lay mostly sevens but for every eight he lays there’ll be two or three sixes. Now, that means his average quality is going to be further below his own rating than for the male six. Why is that? It’s sheer weight of population: eights are rarer than sevens but not as rare as sevens are to sixes. The male seven simply has less to aim at compared to the male six.
Male Eight: the average quality will be lower than eight and again the average quality will be further below his own rating. In practice, nines are out of the question (though most possible for the male eight but he’ll need that perfect storm of value, vibe and luck to bang her). The male eight runs the highest risk of “slumming it.”
That might be dreary reading, but remember that it’s down to things you can’t control: population and normally distributed looks and hypergamy. One thing that is vital to remember is: are you happy with your own results? If you are indeed “slumming it” but you don’t care and are having fun then that’s what’s important. If you do care about other people accusing you of that then the only way out is to give yourself a quality floor and stick to it, but that will reduce your number of lays per year at the same time. The decision is up to you.
It also means that we shouldn’t detract from anyone’s achievements. Let’s take the six, for example: he might have worked incredibly hard to get himself there and turned himself from “invisible” to “dateable.” That’s an amazing achievement which most men couldn’t. The same goes for anyone who made the decision to better themselves; we shouldn’t then look down on them for enjoying the fruits of their labour.
WHY EVEN DO DAYGAME?
Many people report that the quality is higher from Daygame, so just imagine what the average guy is getting from Nightgame! Next consider the survivorship bias in those other forms of Game: imagine how many guys go out and try to pick-up girls at “de cloob;” now imagine how many guys are swiping on dating apps right now. The guys who succeed in Nightgame and online are going to be a tiny, tiny percentage of those who ever tried it. Daygame also offers a health benefit: you don’t have to be out late into the night, you don’t have to drink as much, there’s less bullshit with her friends, etc. There’ll probably be a specific reason why you prefer Daygame to other forms of Game but that’s beyond this post.
There’s also the question of “how would you be doing without Game at all?” Rather than lucking into a one night stand with a drunk six every two years you’re now laying three sixes a year from Daygame who you won over based on your charisma, which is 1000 times more fulfilling. Plus there’s the impetus to grow as a person which Daygame provides. Whether that return is enough for you is for you to decide.
So there you go. Work really hard, don’t mess up, be consistent and get your whole life in order and you can expect to get 12 lays a year with girls who are roughly the same SMV as you, all told. Sounds depressing, but this message is actually one of hope: beginners ought to have realistic expectations for what they are getting into; and all Daygamers ought to be able to compare themselves to realistic expectations so that they can know that they’re actually doing very well.
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